Author Topic: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee  (Read 14658 times)

Offline lion_king

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Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« on: September 18, 2008, 09:00:27 PM »
I'm new to this community and have received several useful replies from people here, again, my wife had a terrible auto accident last year and she is now a RAK amputee. She will try her 1st MPC knee before the end of this year and should get her TEST SUCTION SOCKET anytime. I noticed that 2 members from this forum have some good feedbacks on FREEDOM INNOVATIONS PLIE KNEE, has anyone here had ever tried both C-LEG & PLIE KNEE? Since the PLIE KNEE does not have a locking system, does this mean that :

1. a person has to keep his/her PLIE MPC knee in a certain angle at all time?
2. how a person can sit down without any resistance in the PLIE knee?

Any suggestion or feedback will be much appreciated, thank you.

Lion_King

snowbear

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2008, 09:07:56 PM »
Hi Lion-King..I'm a LBK I can't answer your question..Just wanted to say give you wife my thought's. I'm sure she will do fine, She has much support form you..OH cute dog by the way!

Offline lion_king

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2008, 09:17:58 PM »
thank you, Snowbear. BTW, our little boy is a maltese that I got him last year for my wife, he's kind of a Therapy Dog, yeap, he is very cute and all 3 of us went thru the worst time in our lives together. My wife is so excited when I told her that I found this forum, we will be on board all the time. I think after my wife gets her new socket and a new prosthesis, we then can give other amputees some useful tips as well. As for now, she is still in the early stage of recovering, but for sure everything will be fine when time goes by. 

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2008, 10:22:37 PM »
Its not easy and takes allot of hard work. But with the right attitude and emotional support I'm sure she will be. Fine. I also have a wonderful husband who is very involved in my amputation. I lost my leg 5 years ago due to a bone infection from pins in my leg. I had many operations as a child to try to save it and I lost it on the long run. Its a result form a birth defect so I really never had 2 good legs. By the way we have a mixed terrier dog we rescued. Dogs totally rule.


Have a good night!

Offline guzzitx

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2008, 11:37:29 PM »
All the best LK.
I am LBKA, so not much help on your question, but I agree that dogs help make life living.
Best of luck to you and especially your wife
I have learnt loads here.
Rest assured, you will also.

Offline lion_king

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2008, 01:23:48 AM »
guzzitx, thank you  :D

Offline chrysochloridae

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2008, 02:57:27 PM »
Prosthetic knees are contolled by a combination of Stump control and The Knee joint itself.

Usually, when walking, the user should be pulling their stump backwards when the heel hits the floor; this puts an anticlockwise moment around the knee centre which keeps the knee locked while it is being loaded. To bend the knee, the user 'flicks' the stump forward, this generates a clockwise moment around the knee alowing it to bend; this force is usually generated when the Toe of the foot is loaded.

Sitting down with a free knee is more of a 'controlled fall', Many knees have some sort of stabilising mechanism (e.g. microprocessor, hydraulics) which alow the knee to bend slowly when loaded in a certain way (i.e. they don't collapse under the person without warning!)

I've never seen the PLIE knee so i've got no specific advice regarding ways to use it
 

Offline Robogirl

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2008, 12:17:03 PM »
I wore the C-leg for over 6 years and the Plie' for 2 years now, so have lots of experience with both of them. Growing up I wore several mechanical and hydraulic knees.

OK..... what MPC would be best for your wife?  First of all, I think it's great that she will be able to get a microprocessor knee without fighting the insurance companies like many of us have to do.  That is such a battle!
Which MPC is right for her depends on a lot of things like her activity level and physical condition. Does she have a high level amputation, or is it just above the knee?  Did she run, play sports, etc. before the accident? What activities does she want to do now?  Besides the amputation, does she have other injuries that need to be considered?   Those are all things your prosthetist should consider before making a recommendation to you.

He/she should also explain to you the way that different knees work.  I have not had to use my limb to kick the prosthesis out for years. If you rotate your hips correctly(taking a good, full step on your sound side), the knee of the prosthesis will come through as your hip does.  If your prosthetist does not have a lot of experience in gait training, once her prosthesis has been fit and aligned correctly, try to find a physical therapist who has had experience with amputees. And if he/she starts telling you to do things like "kick the ball", RUN!.... that's very old school and not how modern prostheses work! They should work with you to increase your core strength, and muscles in your gluteous maximus so that you have control of your prosthesis and rotate your hips through evenly. This is possible no matter what type of knee you are using.

Sorry if this all sounds confusing! I know it's a whole new world for you and your wife.  It great that she has your support and that you are doing your research. That will be a tremendous help to her.

Back to your initial question, having used both the C-leg and Plie', I personally prefer the Plie' for the following reasons:   Faster microprocessor (I feel that the knee keeps up with me and I have better control); lighter weight; battery charged separately (C-leg must be plugged into wall and charged and Plie' knee runs on rechargable "camera" batteries, which are charged separately); not necessary to change modes for different activities (I can go from walking to bike riding without making adjustments to my settings - but will make changes if I am walking up/down high inclines).  The Plie' DOES have resistance and stumble control which can be set higher or lower, depending on user preference. I keep it on the low side, which makes me feel less "controlled". But I also have a lot of confidence in my walking.

That being said, I know several people who prefer the C-leg because it is a "safer" knee.  As you mentioned, you can set one of the modes so that it is completely locked. It requires a higher toe load to bend the knee, so you are less likely to trigger it accidentally.

Good luck - and keep asking questions!   :)
"The race does not always go to the swift, but often to those who keep on running."

Offline chrysochloridae

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2008, 01:39:52 PM »
wow... Robogirl totally nailed that one! ;D

I've seen people who find the C-Leg processor feels like 'its a step behind me'

Does anyone know if the PLIE knee is available in the UK? (i.e. does it bear a CE mark?)

Offline lion_king

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2008, 02:57:26 PM »
Robogirl, thank you so much for the info, my wife and I will discuss this further with her prosthetist when she is ready to choose a MPC knee. In fact, her prosthetist said that he might be able to get both C-LEG & PLIE KNEE for my wife to try when the time comes. We understand that a perfect SOCKET is the most important item for an amputee, according to her prosthetist, my wife does have a long residual limb (she is RAK and had surgeries on her left leg as well. Fortunately, her left leg was saved), and since she was a professional dancer in China prior to coming to the States, my wife's prosthetist recommended a MPC knee for her. As for now, my wife is waiting for her new TEST SUCTION SOCKET, she's been wearing a PIN SOCKET for a year, and her stump is pretty stable now. We just need to take one step at a time, and things will get better down the road.

We do have another question for you, even without a locking option, the PLIE knee can still be adjusted to a free swing (no resistance) when sitting down, right? Actually, what is a LOCKING OPTION? Thank you.

Offline Robogirl

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2008, 03:22:29 PM »
You're so welcome!    It would be AWESOME if your wife could try both the C-leg and Plie'.   Being a dancer, I am thinking the Plie' with it's smoother, faster gait would be the best pick - provided her sound leg is in good shape.  I don't quite understand your concern about the resistance when sitting? It's not hard to sit down with either knee; you don't need to do anything special.  Your prosthetist will set the resistance where it's comfortable for you (your weight, strength, etc.) during initial set-up on the computer and any time after that you want to make a change.  People use the locking mode on the C-leg for different reasons:  some like it that way when they climb up/down ladders, others like it stiff when they are riding their motorcycles (so they can support the weight of the bike on that side). It's also good for rollerblading or ice skating. On the C-leg, you can change modes with a remote key pad.  On the Plie' you can set the resistance higher or lower (yes, free swing is possible)using a wrench to adjust settings on the back of the knee, or, you can take the battery out (something I recently tried!) and it gets very "safe", although knee will still bend like that.

I believe "Medi" (not sure of spelling) is the name of the distributor for Plie' in Europe.
"The race does not always go to the swift, but often to those who keep on running."

Offline lion_king

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2008, 06:42:10 PM »
Robogirl, your experiences are really helpful, without the actual knees, it's probably too early to determine which one is the best for my wife. But any feedback from this community is a big plus for our future reference, we will be surfing this forum all the time, good to have someone like you be with us. Thank you. :D

Offline Genki_rockets

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2008, 11:12:20 PM »
Try both knees.  If your wife can't adjust to one, she can always return it. (within a month or so)  I returned my Plie & got a c-leg because Plie has no locking control and "knee woble" control. 

You can't rollerblade, you can't play golf, & you can't do anything that requires the knee to be locked at certain angle with Plie.

People who have been amputees since they were little can wear any knee and they will walk fine.  It's a totally different story for people who become amputees in thier adulthood. 

I can jog, walk backwards, walk up hills, and feel pretty comfortable w c-leg.  I cannot even take a step with rheo.  I did ok with Plie but I would "miss a step" once in a while.  Even though I would rarely "miss a step", when I did, it felf horrible because I could have seriously hurt myself.

Another nice thing about c-leg.  You can get away with having weak stump and weak core muscle; you can still walk almost normal.  I was involved in a serious car accident and my belly stayed open for almost a year.  It was eventually closed but my abdominal muscles were permanently gone.  I am still able to walk comfortably because c-leg has a neat software that prevents the knee from wobbling.

No one can say which is the best knee out there.  You simply have to try as many different knee as possible.  That's the only way to figure out which knee is the best for you.

Lastly, I think above knee amputees need to really watch their weight.  Being overweight is the worst enemy for amputees' ambulation, especially for above knee amputees.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2008, 11:14:04 PM by Genki_rockets »

Offline lion_king

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2008, 01:04:10 AM »
Genki_rockets, we really appreciate your reply and you are 100% correct - my wife has to try to know which knee is best for her, and this is what we intend to do :D. My wife was a dance before, so she knows how to maintain her weight, b/c with the SUCTION SOCKET, keeping her stump at a certain size is the very basic element. Have a nice night, thank you.

Offline chrysochloridae

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Re: Otto Bock C-Leg vs. Freedom Plie Knee
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2008, 06:42:13 AM »
good answer Genki_rockets